|
Ruling
Oct 6, 2009 13:13:53 GMT 10
Post by kylebyrne on Oct 6, 2009 13:13:53 GMT 10
One out runner on 2nd, batter hits a line drive to the 2nd baseman that is caught. R2 retreats back to 2nd. The 2nd baseman then throws the ball to the pitcher errantly and the ball rolls towards the offensive teams dugout. A member of the offensive team stops the ball from rolling into the dugout and throws the ball back to the pitcher...? Whats your call?
|
|
|
Ruling
Oct 7, 2009 6:30:18 GMT 10
Post by hank1044 on Oct 7, 2009 6:30:18 GMT 10
2 man system. Home plate umpire is staying home / P15. Base ump probably at P4, calls the catch on the line drive. No issue at 2nd. No time called after the play I assume. Both Umpires watch the ball. Player comes out of the dugout grabs the ball and throws to the pitcher. Either umpire calls time, and awards R2 to 3rd base only, assuming that R2 is still on 2nd base, and has not moved. Would be interesting to see how the play developed, and what was called. Hank.
|
|
|
Ruling
Oct 7, 2009 8:39:50 GMT 10
Post by mstaylor on Oct 7, 2009 8:39:50 GMT 10
If the offense stops the ball from entering the dugout, I would just let the play go. If the defense stopped it from entering the dugout I would award the bases. I would not call any kind of interference or call any outs. It is penalty enough that the run didn't score because the teammate is an idiot.
|
|
|
Ruling
Oct 7, 2009 10:03:24 GMT 10
Post by kylebyrne on Oct 7, 2009 10:03:24 GMT 10
Hank, Why give the runner 3rd?
|
|
|
Ruling
Oct 7, 2009 16:45:06 GMT 10
Post by QBUA on Oct 7, 2009 16:45:06 GMT 10
Mstaylor, loved the idiot word, made me laugh out loud.
Hank, if you are going to play the interference rule, wouldn't you award home plate, as (correct me if I'm wrong), 2 bases from the time of the throw. Hank, I am not personally aware of the positions you describe in your posting, we use words to describe umpire positions. We do use positions A,B and C, when describing other positions, we use "on the fence line", "1st base line extended","down the line", etc.
Mstaylor, I would go with your call, same as if they leave the bats or other equipment out of the dugout, and the ball gets in between them. Yes Yes, they should have all their equipment in the dugout, unfortunately it is not a perfect world.
|
|
|
Ruling
Oct 7, 2009 16:53:46 GMT 10
Post by kylebyrne on Oct 7, 2009 16:53:46 GMT 10
Refer Rule 3.15 and see if that changes anything...
|
|
|
Ruling
Oct 7, 2009 17:42:00 GMT 10
Post by QBUA on Oct 7, 2009 17:42:00 GMT 10
Kyle, I'm not sure what your looking for here. I'll go out on a limb here and answer myself without going to someone more knowledgeable to make myself look good OK. It all helps me to get my Level 3. I have been accused (and I accept their opinions) in the past of looking to much into the play.
From what I can see, the offensive player has stopped his runner from advancing. Offensive interference from a team mate, there was no play or possible play on a runner where an offensive player could have interfered in that circumstance. Offensive interference, it does not refer to batter-runner, runners or base coaches intentionally interfering. It's not interference by anyone else authorized to be on the field.
|
|
|
Ruling
Oct 7, 2009 17:53:25 GMT 10
Post by kylebyrne on Oct 7, 2009 17:53:25 GMT 10
RULE 3.15 refers to intentional interference by a person authorized to be on the playing field. and states the ruling as: the ball shall be dead at the moment of the interference and the umpire shall impose such penalties as in his opinion will nullify the act of interference.
|
|
|
Ruling
Oct 7, 2009 18:22:46 GMT 10
Post by QBUA on Oct 7, 2009 18:22:46 GMT 10
RULE 3.15 refers to intentional interference by a person authorized to be on the playing field. and states the ruling as: the ball shall be dead at the moment of the interference and the umpire shall impose such penalties as in his opinion will nullify the act of interference. Yes the ball is dead, no runners may advance. Kyle, wouldn't that throw out the common sense rule, what is fair? If we played that rule to the word, then every member of the offensive team would be running out of the dugout to stop every ball at the fence, as long as it looked close to going into the dugout for a free run or two. "the umpire shall impose such penalties as in his opinion will nullify the act of interference". Therefore, I would impose a penalty that no runner may advance, to nullify the act of interference. Is that what you are looking for?
|
|
|
Ruling
Oct 8, 2009 0:52:56 GMT 10
Post by hank1044 on Oct 8, 2009 0:52:56 GMT 10
Just thought I would play devils advocate for discussion, from a play I saw last year in MLB. Dodgers vs. St. Louis. Basically the same play. After the catch on the line drive. The 2nd baseman saw the catcher coming up to talk to the pitcher. The pitcher turned his back on the 2nd baseman, so he looked at the ball a waived to the 2nd base umpire that the ball was no longer playable, and threw the ball at the offensive team's dugout. An offensive player came out, grabbed the ball, threw it into the crowd, and went into the dugout. Time was not called prior to, by the catcher or the 2nd baseman. The home plate umpire killed the play dead, then awarded R2 third base, on an apparent interference. Out comes the manager. Instead of asking for interpretation, he started screaming, and got tossed. Nothing else happened, and the play stood. The TV guys doing the game were just a puzzled as I was. I agree with Taylor. Let the play go. For Kyle's why 3rd ? The above Dodger game. If the ball was stopped by the defensive team, then I would agree with the moderator. 2 from the throw. Again for the moderator, P1 = Position 1 " behind the plate ", P2 = 12 to 15 ft past 1st. P3 = right of the pitcher / half way to 2nd. P4 = Left of the pitcher. P5 = 12 to 15 ft past 3rd. P15 = 15 ft up the 3rd base line. What are the comparisons to your A B C etc.? Great discussion guys ! Hank.
|
|
|
Ruling
Oct 8, 2009 10:30:18 GMT 10
Post by kylebyrne on Oct 8, 2009 10:30:18 GMT 10
Its simple guys. "the umpire shall impose such penalties as in his opinion will nullify the act of interference". Its the same as spectator interference, the ball would have gone into the dugoutb had the interference not occured, it doesnt matter who stopped the ball, it could have been the bat boy for all i care.. it would have been a thrown ball out of play, therefore the umpire must award two bases and score R2...
|
|